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| User Info | Commercial Real Estate Check: 99% Loss in forum [Ticker] | |||
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26 
KD^2 
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http://market-ticker.org/archives/1635-C....
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-11-17 14:52:10
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Ldog Posts: 185 Incept: 2009-06-11
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Like EXDS to zero.
2009-11-17 14:54:51
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Ck_dexter Posts: 1412 Incept: 2007-07-19 
SE PA
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still waiting for the day that cash flow becomes important.
---------- "When plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men living together in society, they create for themselves, in the course of time, a legal system that authorizes it and a moral code that glorifies it." - Frédéric Bastiat
2009-11-17 15:02:18
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Randy123 Posts: 2006 Incept: 2008-09-24 New Jersey Online
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Lever up the 1%....See that, good as new.
---------- Mliu is my hero. Captain melamine.
2009-11-17 15:04:12
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Cobradriver Posts: 51 Incept: 2009-08-04 Port Charlotte,Fl
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I love to use this example at work... 1/2 acre waterfront lot,1 canal off the Peace River. No bridges. Peak price,2005, 255K. 2 years on the MLS dropping to 35K. No sale. Recently pulled per the realtor for "Unrealistic offers". They likely had none. Monthly carrying cost...400/mo in taxes due to no ability to homestead. Empty lot,remember? YEARLY taxes in 2000...350. Not 3500,three hundred and fifty for the whole year. I know you have seen places like this around you Karl... Chris Last modified:
2009-11-17 15:06:40 by cobradriver
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Markytom Posts: 217 Incept: 2009-02-19 
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What a difference a year makes . . . This isn't the first time Pontiac has tried to sell and redevelop the Silverdome. According to the News, the city agreed last year to sell the property for $20 million to Bloomfield Hills attorney H. Wallace Parker, who considered creating a $175-million family entertainment complex on the site. However, the deal fell through after Parker failed to close on the deal by a deadline of Nov. 1, 2008. http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index..... Last modified:
2009-11-17 15:48:37 by markytom
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Arkady Posts: 123 Incept: 2009-10-19
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Hey KD, were you once a registered Democrat? Just curious...
2009-11-17 15:24:02
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Nope.
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-11-17 15:30:12
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Bezzle Posts: 3859 Incept: 2009-08-02
Moonbat Patrol
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It'd sure be nice if the Silverdome were a large component of DRN. (How on earth is something that was almost worth $20M a year ago not worth more than .5M now? ....Who's the new owner, and what sweetheart deal did they finagle? Something doesn't add up.) ---------- Why would you try to stop this? A bond-market dislocation puts an instant stop to all the bull****. It is the only limiting factor left in this interventionist madness. It is an almost holy event. -- Christian Gustafson
2009-11-17 15:34:37
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Nobody wants it due to the upkeep and property tax costs.
---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-11-17 15:37:03
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Arkady Posts: 123 Incept: 2009-10-19
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I don't understand your objection to trade. It does suck to lose domestic jobs, but if we can get goods elsewhere for a cheaper price then we do so. Ultimately the consumer benefits. Of course these goods happen to be tainted with all sorts of crap it should give us pause and perhaps we need to reconsider doing business with that country, but same with labor. Labor is just like any other investment and if the investment is cheaper elsewhere, then our companies move elsewhere. Whose fault is that? If working conditions are so prohibitively expensive then we need to change that, setting up trade barriers is hardly the solution.
2009-11-17 15:38:31
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Bagbalm Posts: 979 Incept: 2009-03-19
Just North of Detroit
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The Dome is about seven miles from where we live. Pontiac missed chances to sell it for more but the politics in Pontiac are very much like Detroit. Everyone is opposed to everyone else. The meetings are like a kindergarten before nap time with no teacher to moderate. And sorry to say - like every black city government I have seen - run on the tribal system due to their wonderful culture. You hire all your cousins and it don't matter if they have any idea how to do the job. Bribes and influence peddling are just normal. The best thing that can be said about the Silverdome is you can get right to it on the expressway so you don't have to drive through Pontiac. In fact it is right on the boundry to Auburn Hills which is still part of civilization. They have the Chrysler Headquarters about a mile away. Oakland county would be better off without Pontiac. It's the armpit of the county just like Detroit is to Michigan. Whoever bought it is going to have to deal with a city government that will try to extract all sorts of conditions and promises to actually do anything with it. Affirmitive action to the max. I hope they budgeted lots of cash for permits and studies and palm lining. I wouldn't have taken it for free. Chances are the city will run the new owners broke with crazy unending demands and take it back for taxes. I can't wait to hear what they try to tax them in fact. Last modified:
2009-11-17 15:47:23 by bagbalm
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Markytom Posts: 217 Incept: 2009-02-19
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This is how the city of Pontiac advertised it: Outstanding Investment Opportunity Considered an excellent high-profile redevelopment opportunity, the Pontiac Silverdome, an 80,300-seat stadium, is prominently situated on 127+/- acres accessible by I-75 and M-59. Built at a cost of $55.7 million, the dome was the largest arena in the NFL when it opened in 1975. The “gateway site” will lend interested buyers an array of development options. "We are excited about the Pontiac Silverdome Auction and finding a new owner to become a key member of our community,” said City of Pontiac Emergency Financial Manager Fred Leeb. “The decision to sell via absolute auction illustrates our commitment to sell the stadium and convert an expense into a vibrant future development." According to Leeb, “What's important for bidders to realize is that this is not just a large site. This is a prominent location and it is in a city that will do all it can do to welcome business and foster a new way of operating in the state of Michigan. Oakland County, where Pontiac is located is ranked the fourth most affluent county in the US, featuring the wealthy townships of Bloomfield Hills, Birmingham and Royal Oak. The Silverdome is located next to major thoroughfares such as I-75, M-59, University Drive and Woodward Avenue. All pluses for new owners.” To walk into the huge structure that is the Silverdome can still take your breath away. With a seating capacity of 80,311, its still one of the largest in the world. The Silverdome was home to the National Football League’s Detroit Lions, the National Basketball Association’s Detroit Pistons and the United States Football League’s Michigan Panthers. It has seen major events such as Super Bowl 16 and the 1994 FIFA World Cup. The dome established the largest indoor attendance record for a sporting event when Hulk Hogan met Andre the Giant in the World Wrestling Entertainment’s WrestleMania III. The Lion's franchise moved from the Silverdome in 2002 and while the Silverdome has had periodic and varied use since then, its owner, the City of Pontiac has chosen to auction the dome and the land it is on in an effort to stimulate development in their city. http://www.williamsauction.com/silverdom....
2009-11-17 15:45:28
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Imnotpotus Posts: 79 Incept: 2008-04-14
Lost Angeles
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Hot Tip to anyone in general Quite a few stadiums use titanium in the retractable roof members. Toronto sold their stadium for less than the salvage costs of the titanium in it's roof. ---------- Coming Soon. Look for the TV series Holiday Special on Canada West.
2009-11-17 15:47:07
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Quote:It does suck to lose domestic jobs, but if we can get goods elsewhere for a cheaper price then we do so. Ultimately the consumer benefits. No they don't - if they lose their job then they don't benefit at all from the "cheaper price" as they have no income to purchase with. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-11-17 15:48:04
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Widgeon Posts: 6527 Incept: 2007-08-30
OK Online
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... it was all done w/ cheap and unrealistically available debt ... it was not "trade." Plus, the "trade" that did occur, in fact, was not goods-for-goods ... they traded for/stole "our" jobs w/ the complete complicity of our "leadership." They are TRAITORS. You can't have a functioning society and a working social contract when all of your quality jobs are sent away. As we are finding out, it doesn't matter how cheap stuff is if you don't have income. Don't get me started on the "quality" of the goods we're getting back either.
2009-11-17 15:52:34
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Margincalltime Posts: 830 Incept: 2008-04-01
NJ
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Quote:No they don't - if they lose their job then they don't benefit at all from the "cheaper price" as they have no income to purchase with. I think you're both right in your own ways. Comparative advantage should work in a normal economy, but the problem is our leaders somehow think they can keep incomes/prices up, yet export the ability to earn an income and support prices. Cake and eat it too syndrome??? Last modified:
2009-11-17 15:54:34 by margincalltime
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Bagbalm Posts: 979 Incept: 2009-03-19
Just North of Detroit
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The Dome is air supported. One winter the caretaker was up north deer hunting and we had an early heavy wet snow. Since there was nobody to turn the fans up the fabric caved in and ripped cables out of the concrete. The entry doors are revolving style because of the pressure differential. It takes longer to get crowds in and out because people - the women especially will stand and wait for the person ahead to get out the other side so they can step into the door when it is not turning fast. Very few will time it and step into the turning door and keep it moving. I suspect all the huge parking lot around the building is as valuable as the Dome itself. I wouldn't be surprised to see the new owners demolish it. Newer places like the nearby Palace were designed to have more private boxes.
2009-11-17 15:57:13
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Lastchance Posts: 1132 Incept: 2008-11-19 Las Vegas
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What a mark-down. Does it count as deflation? I used to live in Michigan. I saw Led Zeppelin in the Silverdome some 34 years ago. Saw more than a few Detroit Pistons and Detroit Lions game there. Times were good back then. Just get it over with and build a casino there. ---------- "We don't quit. I don't quit" President Obama 1/27/10 Man, I would to have him in one of our poker games.
2009-11-17 16:05:28
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Arkady Posts: 123 Incept: 2009-10-19
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Our leaders stemming all the way from the 1930s and Hoover administration believe foolishly that high wages = prosperity. Wages should be determined on the free market just like any price on any capital good or consumer good. Manipulating the wage distorts the supply/demand structure and yields very nasty consequences, once again look at the 1929,30,31,32. Our government also emboldens and empowers the unions to constantly negotiate higher and higher wages. I can appreciate that unions are simply trying to protect themselves from inflation, but when they do not allow for correct wage adjustment during a contraction this country falls into despair. Karl mandating that we should maintain production for the sake of people being employed is simply anti-free market. If we deem the goods that we buy from China to be inadequate then a market will exist domestically, otherwise we will not. If the production costs are too expensive due to corporate taxes, social security, medicare and other mandates along with unions artificially holding up wages - then the problem is political. Going the way of Smoot-Hawley is repeating the erroneous past.
2009-11-17 16:05:44
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Genesis Posts: 71432 Incept: 2007-06-26
KD^2
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Arkady, there is no "free trade" when the worker in the other nation is literally "employed" at gunpoint and his family (or he) is imprisoned or shot when he is unhappy with his wages and station in life. I have no problem with free and fair competition. That's what makes the world work. I have a major problem with exploitation and cheating. ---------- "The monetary base in ALL modern monetary systems is the sum of unencumbered assets against which one is both WILLING AND ABLE to borrow." - Me
2009-11-17 16:07:22
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Rknoflach Posts: 157 Incept: 2007-10-22
Macomb, MI
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I want the trough urinals!
---------- All your base are belong to GS!
2009-11-17 16:14:24
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Arkady Posts: 123 Incept: 2009-10-19
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We cannot cut off trade with people whose methods we find deplorable. My current impression of China is that their corporate markets are as "free" as ours, although when dealing with a Communist government one can never be sure. Regardless if we are able to obtain certain items at a discount and the quality is satisfactory to us then we should do so. Technically speaking, if their working conditions are as bad as you make them out to be then they should have a very hard time competing against us in the long term. Just like the American South was having a very hard time competing with the North, despite the fact that their slaves were "cheap" labor, practice proves that serfs are simply NOT as efficient. Therefore if we are being truly outproduced then it should not matter to us what methods are employed in China. If we are outproduced primarily because our costs have RISEN to the point where it is no longer profitable, then we have a political problem and it needs to be addressed. Unfortunately the unions will never allow this as their control over Congress is as powerful as Goldman's.
2009-11-17 16:15:54
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Tm22721 Posts: 516 Incept: 2008-01-09
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It won't stop until the USA is manufacturing toys and selling them in China.
---------- Joe Terranova: "I'm long Amazon...once it goes above 90 it gets to 100...it's that old 9-10 thing. Once you get above the 9 it always goes to 10." Tim Seymour: "Once it gets to the 8 it goes to the 7 and then the 6..."
2009-11-17 16:29:17
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Lowbeyond Posts: 6902 Incept: 2008-02-11
CO Online
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But but but. That is all besides the point. You are not calculating the dollar value of the happiness the vocal minority got 8 weeks a year, each and every year! Public funding of stadiums, always seems to be a net economic loser. But they keep going up. Interesting that. ---------- Maybe it was a birdy bread-bomber from the future?!
2009-11-17 16:45:54
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